"Basketball Tradition Lives at Rose Hill Gym"

[DamnRam]

Saw this article on Fordham's website regarding the RHG.  A tiny bit of history and a few old photos of the RHG, then it segues into a pitch for season tickets.  I would have much preferred to see a lot of history, and then a very short pitch with a link to the season ticket sales page.

http://www.fordham.edu/Campus_Resources/eNewsroom/topstories_1687.asp

[txram]

Proud to say I was there for every one of the home 25-game win streak games from '67-'69 mentioned in the historical highlights. 
Ask the players - the fans made a big difference in giving us home court advantage, and it was largely students who packed the gym.  But then, that was another era, a different world, and we had better coaching.

[vinnys]

considering our recent history, its amazing that there have been only 8 losing seasons at RHG in the past 30 years  !!!

[John]

"Tradition lives . . . " along with some stranded pigeons.  Heck, at least somebody's is trying, which counts for a lot. But the line about the gym having seen "only 8 losing seasons in the past 30 years" probably brings the art of lying with statistics to a new high (or low).

I was in the crowd of 4500 in 1991 for the NIT game against UMass. We would meet the Minutemen in the NCAAs the next year. Unfortunately, they were intact and Damon Lopez had graduated from our squad. But it shows that the RHG can be a pit if we get the team fired up.

I've said it before . . . if we're going to ensure how many years in the RHG, we should decorate the place with posters and banners and videos of great players who've played there. There IS a huge amount of hoops history there . . . a lot of it not from Fordham varsity teams. But I've seen Jabbar, Doctor J, Bill Bradley, and dozens of other hoops greats play on the court. While it's not an adequate modern D-1 facility, it is one of the more/most important buildings in American basketball history, and should be celebrated as such. I'd decorate the place with banners showing these players as well as Fordham greats like Cunningham, Charles, Brown, Paterno, etc.  Yes, we know it's old and no longer adequate, but promoting its historic side would at least spare us the need to apologize for being there.

[RC74]

"The sight of the long-awaited gym is enough to instill in every Fordhamite a full-grown superiority complex."

La plu c'est change, la plus c'est le meme chose!

What was it Santanya said??

[Ram 91]

Sounds like they're telling us to get used to playing in RHG for the next twenty or more years.

[B2Bomber]

St. Louis University just built a huge new arena.   Then again, aside from soccer, SLU has nothing going for it in athletics except Men's BBall.     And WashU is DivIII and there are no competitors within 100 miles.    So its the only game in town for NCAA Div1 hoops.   No NBA team any longer, either.   

It is a bit bizarre with so many Fordham alumns in the city, many of whom have more money than they know what to do with...don't attend Fordham basketball games.   Or football games for that matter.    They will stroke a check to the annual fund or capital campaign and then walk away.    Whereas if they were diehard fans, they could make a lot of noise about getting rid of Grank and DW.   

Whose fault is that?   Alumni Association?    Athletic Dept?  Marketing?     Or does ALL of this fall on the lap of Grank?   

[jimbo65]

It is a bit bizarre with so many Fordham alumns in the city, many of whom have more money than they know what to do with...don't attend Fordham basketball games.   Or football games for that matter.    They will stroke a check to the annual fund or capital campaign and then walk away.    Whereas if they were diehard fans, they could make a lot of noise about getting rid of Grank and DW.   

Whose fault is that?   Alumni Association?    Athletic Dept?  Marketing?     Or does ALL of this fall on the lap of Grank?   

IMO the cause of what you relate is a failed athletic program.  I may be off on the numbers a bit but we have had one or two winning bball seasons in the last how many years.  How about four wins (including two forfeits) under TBC coach and last year's fiasco.  Fball fared better but in the same peiod we have not consistently had winning records and at least one zero win season.

I do not know what Jeff Gray does as to athletics but Frank's time in office has been a failure.  Is that his fault, I don't know.  Think back when Penders left (in my opinion our best coach in 50 years).  A "nationwide" search was announced.  Lefty Driesel supposedly considered and one year later, the Canisius Coach hired.  Seems to me he could have been selected in one week.

In the end, its the "Tone from the Top".  The real blame for the athletic failure lies in Fr. O'Hare (whom I have met, like & respect) and in Fr. McShane (no informed opinion).  To use a legal phrase, "they either knew or should have known" .  Their approach to athletics failed.  I'm particularly suprised re. Fr. O'Hare as I believe he genuinely liked athletics.

[fordhamramfan08]

Some of you may disagree but I think all of us need to fill up this gym up first before we can expect plans for a new one. I know we don't have the best team but there should be enough support and people in and around the city in order to pack that gym up every game. It's just really sad that students at Fordham, never mind the alums, don't even attend the game. I just think the marketing is terrible and the entire athletics department and management is to blame. They just do not do enough to generate buzz and excitement. I know they recently started doing some things this year on their website in order to coax people into getting season tickets and I'll give them kudos to scheduling games at the Izod center and at MSG, but more needs to be done. We have enough students/alums/Fordham supporters to fill that gym up if we wanted to.

[Bronx Boy]

I think all of us need to fill up this gym up first before we can expect plans for a new one.  I know we don't have the best team but there should be enough support and people in and around the city in order to pack that gym up every game.

We don't have the best team ?

We don't even have a mediocre team, and therein lies the rub.

Even die hard fans do not enjoy going to games to see their team gettin' blown out, game after game, so don't expect SRO crowds in the old Rose Hill Gym any time soon 

We have dug a very deep hole, and it will take a very long time to climb out of it.

As fer da buildin' of a new sports arena ?  The second millenium will arrive before that comes to pass.

[B2Bomber]

In politics they call it  "political will" or "gravitas."      That is what we need.   From the leadership, both Grank and DW to start.

Blaming O'Hare and McShane only goes so far.   They aren't experts at athletics nor should they be expected to become so.    BUT...they are the ones who sign off on the hiring of an Athletic Director and Head Coach.    And they rely on the BOT to give them counsel.     

What I find so bizarre is the laid back attitude of the mulitudes of Fordham alumni about this situation.   At any other school, the alumni would be up on arms....the booster club would demand immediate changes.

Look at Duke.  The doormat of the ACC in football for decades.    They went through several coaching changes..and finally got it right...and are now a serious threat to anyone in the league.     Now they have lots of money, but they also have a strong alumni association who basically tell the school, "win or change the coaching team."   

We should be the same.   

We don't have to be like Columbia.    We will never be like BC.    But we can be respectable and consistent.   

[fordhamramfan08]

We don't have the best team ?

We don't even have a mediocre team, and therein lies the rub.

Even die hard fans do not enjoy going to games to see their team gettin' blown out, game after game, so don't expect SRO crowds in the old Rose Hill Gym any time soon 

We have dug a very deep hole, and it will take a very long time to climb out of it.

As fer da buildin' of a new sports arena ?  The second millenium will arrive before that comes to pass.

Last year, we were being blown out every single game due to a lot of factors. We just did not have the players (and yes DW is a terrible coach to add to it) and injuries made it worse. Of course, we should have done a better job recruiting, knowing that our entire starting lineup was going to graduate. But calling the team "not even a mediocre team" before the start of a new season isn't going to help anything. We have a different team this year and certainly some things to look forward to (new recruiting class, returning players from last year, more healthy bodies this year hopefully). No one knows for a fact if we are going to get blown out every game this season. I know I should not have jumped to any conclusions saying that we will hit .500 this year in my earlier posts, which in fact is very unrealistic and not happen. But at least we can be somewhat excited about this season and give them a chance. Maybe they'll surprise us being losing single digits during the home games instead of 20. If the games are fun and competitive, I don't see a reason why we should not be able to fill the gym up (which I did not see consistently during my years at Fordham when Dunston and company were playing).

[Bronx Boy]

I don't see a reason why we should not be able to fill the gym up, which I did not see consistently during my years at Fordham when Dunston and company were playing.

If we couldn't play to SRO crowds when Dunston, Stout and Greene were playin', why on earth do ya think we could pack da place now ?

Yer gonna see da same old, same old, this season.

Why ?

New packa cards, but da same dealer's still shuffling da same tired old plays and he's still dealin' his own brand of nonsense.

I ain't buyin' into his system.

We ain't gonna hit twenty-one in dis game.

[fordhamramfan08]

Yea that was exactly my point. The crowds turning up at the games has nothing to do with us being blown out or not. When the team was doing well with Dunston, half the games were still half empty. There just isn't enough support for the team. Most people in the school don't care about basketball or know that we actually play in a decent conference. The marketing has always been horrendous. The school never does anything to generate enough excitement irregardless of whether the teams are good or not.

[txram]

Yea that was exactly my point. The crowds turning up at the games has nothing to do with us being blown out or not. When the team was doing well with Dunston, half the games were still half empty. There just isn't enough support for the team. Most people in the school don't care about basketball or know that we actually play in a decent conference. The marketing has always been horrendous. The school never does anything to generate enough excitement irregardless of whether the teams are good or not.

Key word:  "marketing".  Being horrendous is an understatement.