RMU vs. Villanova

[fromglorydays]

BTW, Vin, if you're examining "quality of wins," RMU beat Ohio. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that trumps Stony Brook.

[Bronx Boy]

Vinseiro = another Grasso flunky.

Vinseiro = another Rambacker funky.

Now, that's creepy !

[ace93]

Vinseiro = another Rambacker funky.

Now, that's creepy !

Enough!!

[RAM71]

Ian O'Connor on Twitter at end of RMU game:

Mike Rice acting like a lunatic in final minutes might be hurting his Seton Hall candidacy as much as Robert Morris effort is helping it   

[Kaup]

Ian O'Connor on Twitter at end of RMU game:

Mike Rice acting like a lunatic in final minutes might be hurting his Seton Hall candidacy as much as Robert Morris effort is helping it   

On "Mike and Mike" this morning, Greenberg and Gottlieb said he acted with "remarkable restraint" given the officiating.

[Bronx Boy]

Mike Rice acting like a lunatic in final minutes ...

Given the bias of the officiating in those final minutes ?

I'd be surprised if he didn't react the way he did.

His actions constitute justifiable lunacy, ... and very few can fault him for that. 

[Thump and Honk]

Go back and read, genius, I've given Rice and Abraham all the reasonable credit.

The problem is that fans of Rice cannot accept ANY criticism of him, even when it is supported by quotes and game facts.

All coaches have flaws, except for Rice, I guess.

Again with your verbal slight of hand.  "Reasonable credit."  Your posts read like decisions from bad judges: tossing out vague terminology with undefined standards in efforts to look like you're being fair.  Your "reasonable credit" is Rice did good, except for your inferences that he didn't do good; Abraham was a good find, except he for your inferences that he wasn't a good find.  

I like Rice.  He's certainly in my top 5 wishlist for coaches.  However, when I think of the pros and cons of prospective candidates, I wouldn't consider recruiting a player that turned out to be good and almost beating Villanova in the opening round of the tourney as being points of contention.  His temperament, that's something to criticize.  His getting RMU into post-season play the past two years, not.

Here's a question: are you this critical of Grasso?  I'll answer that one for you: no, you're not.  Both these guys have their good and bad points.  However, don't pretend like you're being anything remotely close to even-handed with these guys.  You have your preference (a "gut" pick, as you've said), and that's fine.  However, don't masquerade your preference under the guise of "fair criticism."

[joeb]

from the hartford courant "Mike Rice would be a good candidate for any job," Wright said. "He's got great passion. He's a great teacher."
He's demanding and he's emotional and makes no apologies for it. He had to be calmed by his players at Quinnipiac and again Thursday. He's not mean. He is a little crazy when the whistle doesn't go his way.[/color] He's on his knees, running around, throwing his arms around. His antics were called compelling and interesting by one questioner, and Rice said, "I told my wife the same thing. She disagrees.
http://www.courant.com/sports/other/hc-jacobs-column-ncaa-0319.artmar19,0,151985.column

[Vinseiro]

Again with your verbal slight of hand.  "Reasonable credit."  Your posts read like decisions from bad judges: tossing out vague terminology with undefined standards in efforts to look like you're being fair.  Your "reasonable credit" is Rice did good, except for your inferences that he didn't do good; Abraham was a good find, except he for your inferences that he wasn't a good find.  

I like Rice.  He's certainly in my top 5 wishlist for coaches.  However, when I think of the pros and cons of prospective candidates, I wouldn't consider recruiting a player that turned out to be good and almost beating Villanova in the opening round of the tourney as being points of contention.  His temperament, that's something to criticize.  His getting RMU into post-season play the past two years, not.

Here's a question: are you this critical of Grasso?  I'll answer that one for you: no, you're not.  Both these guys have their good and bad points.  However, don't pretend like you're being anything remotely close to even-handed with these guys.  You have your preference (a "gut" pick, as you've said), and that's fine.  However, don't masquerade your preference under the guise of "fair criticism."

1. "verbal slight of hand", "inferences", "vague terminology", "undefined standards" ?!?!  Dude, this ain't political talk radio, it's a message forum on an inconsequential college bball program (sorry, Ace  )  I speak directly, usually supported by facts, quotes, or other objective grounds.  Now you get to define what kind of credit is acceptable to give Rice?  Don't think so.  Easy now.

2.  My beef with respect to Abraham began when Rice supporters claimed Abraham as evidence of Rice's recruiting prowess and player evaluation skills.  That's been disproven, period.  The Rice supporters just can't admit it.  I don't think it makes Rice a non-starter, but it does leave some open questions about his abilities and how he'll be successful here.

3.  I've said that Grasso is a gut pick.  He's a young kid with very little in terms of a record.  He won 1 game.  What else do you want me to say?  I've said that he is my preference, no masquerading there.  We've tried the experienced head coach approach multiple times and that has gotten us nowhere.  I'm throwing away the paper record because it's brought us disaster before, we need energy, hard work, and ambition, not someone for whom this job should be much more than what we offer, leading, yet again, to a frustrated HC.  Grasso's recruiting ability and connection to talented kids, their parents, and coaches is excellent.  I've also named other assistants.  You can search for those posts if you like.  Plenty of schools are successful bringing in young assistants over more "experienced" coaches.  We should be looking to do the same.

[Ram 91]

We can add "revisionist history".  Look back on the thread, you were the first to talk about Abraham and dismissed his effort, then later called it "reasonable credit".  Here's reasonable credit:  He made shots.

Once again, I'll ask the question you leave unanswered:  Which assistants?  We know you like Grasso, which other assistants, and do you rate any of them higher than Grasso?  Or is the alpha and omega of assistant coaches too?

[Vinseiro]

We can add "revisionist history".  Look back on the thread, you were the first to talk about Abraham and dismissed his effort, then later called it "reasonable credit".  Here's reasonable credit:  He made shots.

Once again, I'll ask the question you leave unanswered:  Which assistants?  We know you like Grasso, which other assistants, and do you rate any of them higher than Grasso?  Or is the alpha and omega of assistant coaches too?

Try to keep up:

1.  The Abraham argument goes back before this thread.  Started by the claim that Abraham was the example of Rice's recruiting prowess and eye.  Look it up if you care so much.  It's out there.

2.  2x now:  I posted those assistants shortly after DW was let go and Masiello before Grasso.  Look it up if it matters to you.

Just dense.

[PA Ram]

Funny that I used to be a fan of Grasso before Vinseiro came in with this billiant defense strategy.  Every time I come back to being able to think rationally about Grasso, I read more posts by him and Grasso takes a few more hits. 

Vinseiro = double agent?  Is he somehow working against Grasso by seeming to work for him? 

[Vinseiro]

Funny that I used to be a fan of Grasso before Vinseiro came in with this billiant defense strategy.  Every time I come back to being able to think rationally about Grasso, I read more posts by him and Grasso takes a few more hits. 

Vinseiro = double agent?  Is he somehow working against Grasso by seeming to work for him? 

Actually, I named Rice a finalist way back in early December.  Way ahead of some of his current fans.  Look it up.

But of course I have more than a clue about what I speak, while you've contributed what?

[EagleMorph]

Okay, how's this for recruiting...

Abraham moved into the lineup when senior guard Jimmy Langhurst went out with a knee injury. Langhurst was originally a point guard, after fracturing his finger just before the season, he was moved to 2 guard (which is why Abraham eventually replaced him). The kid that replaced Langhurst at the point was Velton Jones, a redshirt freshman.

Jones ran the offense and helped guide the team to this NCAA Tourney run. Abraham scored the points, Jones set him up.

Robert Morris played three true freshmen and two redshirt freshmen in Thursday's game against Villanova. Three of those 1st year players played 25+ minutes.

[Ram I Am]

Actually, I named Rice a finalist way back in early December.  Way ahead of some of his current fans.  Look it up.

But of course I have more than a clue about what I speak, while you've contributed what?

Let's be clear, Vinny.  You haven't been in on the ground floor with Rice.  You've been been drinking the JG Kool-Aid for months.  You've been critical of Rice for quite a while, but have turned the corner a bit of late by damning him with faint praise.  I don't mind you hopping on the bandwagon, Vinny, there's plenty of room aboard.  Just don't be intellectually dishonest about it.

[Rich93]

The only question right now is will Fordham do what it takes to get a candidate like Rice which means making our best offer and pitch instead of intimating he is in competition with others who do not have a resume that comes close to his.  We need Rice's passion for the game and hatred for losing, right now it seems if the team plays well for 10 minutes that is enough as long as the coach is liked by the students and alums.  Is Fordham serious about turning this program around, if so be agressive and get the best young coach out there, Mike Rice. 

[ayteefie]

But of course I have more than a clue about what I speak, while you've contributed what?

[JohnG92]

The only question right now is will Fordham do what it takes to get a candidate like Rice which means making our best offer and pitch instead of intimating he is in competition with others who do not have a resume that comes close to his.  We need Rice's passion for the game and hatred for losing, right now it seems if the team plays well for 10 minutes that is enough as long as the coach is liked by the students and alums.  Is Fordham serious about turning this program around, if so be agressive and get the best young coach out there, Mike Rice. 

If we don't get Rice, I am going to be disappointed.  Imagine you're an opponent, you're going into the RHG, the bandbox that it is, and have to face his defense for 40 minutes, in front of a packed house screaming the entire game?  Tell me we don't win most of those games.

Frank, you have to convince Fr. McShane that Rice is not a risk. Yes, he yells, yes, he's animated, but his players get what he's all about. He wants to win very badly. His players are WITH him. 

[Bronx Boy]

If we don't get Rice, I am going to be disappointed.  Imagine you're an opponent, you're going into the RHG, the bandbox that it is, and have to face his defense for 40 minutes, in front of a packed house screaming the entire game ?  Tell me we don't win most of those games.

Mike Rice is sitting in the catbird's seat when it comes to job offers.  Good fer him !

If he decides to come to Rose Hill, ... we have a good chance of winning some games.

If he decides on something else, ... we will be back to the same old, same old.

I don't think Grasso, decent recruiter and nice guy that he is, will be able to do the job.  He needs more seasoning with a good mentor to be truly effective.  We will see more of him down the road.

[fromglorydays]

Trouble is, Vin, for all of JG's good points, they are of little consequence when measured against the most important criteria for a coach (as the Roberts experience has demonstrated): winning. He has never won, not anywhere. And though you and the believers can keep saying that no one could have won with the team he largely recruited, the fact is he has yet to prove he can coach a team to more than one win. This is not just taking a chance, it is delusional. I say again that any AD who would hire a head coach with a 1 - 21 record would be hooted out of his job. They wouldn't do it. You just can't refute that. Rice and Pecora on the other hand, have shown they can consistently coach a team to 20+ wins. Whether they can do it in the A-10 may be open to some question, but JG hasn't done it anywhere. It's not his time.